NFL Nation: Leslie O'Neal

For the purposes of Hall of Fame discussions, Kevin Greene isn't really "ours." Greene played outside linebacker for four teams in his 15-year career, but none of them were in the NFC North or former NFC Central. But his current position as the Green Bay Packers' outside linebackers coach makes his Hall of Fame candidacy (or lack thereof) a topical offseason point.

[+] EnlargeKevin Greene
Joseph Patronite/Getty ImagesDespite 160 sacks, Kevin Greene remains on the outside looking in when it comes to the Hall of Fame.
Saturday's election of Chris Doleman sharpened the focus on Greene's largely ignored candidacy. Dolman's career total of 150.5 sacks ranks below Greene on the NFL's all-time list, but he became the sixth pass-rusher in the past five years to win election.

The chart shows the top 12 pass-rushers in NFL history, at least based on career sack totals. Eight of them are in the Hall of Fame and two, Michael Strahan and Jason Taylor, aren't eligible yet. That leaves Green and Leslie O'Neal (132.5 sacks) as the only players in this 12-man group to be sitting on the outside.

Greene's 160 career sacks stand out starkly on the chart. If the 44-member voting committee values sacks as much as it appears to, why has Greene remained on the periphery of the conversation? On Saturday, I threw out via Twitter an opportunity to provide a devil's advocate argument to explain a statistical anomaly.

Besides the standard jokes about bias against long hair, most of you suggested the committee considers Greene a specialist. Wrote @kgilly75: "Because all he could do is rush the passer...not good in coverage or run support.."

Again, we in the NFC North aren't really in position to advocate or argue against Greene's candidacy. But given the respect that pass-rushers have received in recent elections, I'm not sure if it's appropriate to place an "all he could do" in front of "rush the passer." Do you? Just curious.

Jared Allen and Julius PeppersUS PresswireWill Canton make room for predominant pass-rushers Jared Allen and Julius Peppers?
Another in a series on NFC North players whose career trajectory puts them on a path to consideration for the Pro Football Hall of Fame.

NFL teams value pass rushing more than any skill outside of quarterbacking, and here in the NFC North we have two of the best of this generation. Chicago Bears defensive end Julius Peppers (89 career sacks) and Minnesota Vikings defensive end Jared Allen (83) have outright dominated many games during their careers. But is either on track for future enshrinement in Canton, Ohio?

My short answer: It could go either way.

Sacks didn't become an official statistic until 1982. In reviewing how Hall of Fame voters have judged pass-rushers since then, a few tenets seem clear:

  1. Sack totals alone, no matter how high, don't guarantee enshrinement. Otherwise, linebacker Kevin Greene (currently a Green Bay Packers assistant coach) and defensive end Chris Doleman would have been elected a long time ago. Greene has 160 career sacks, the third-most in NFL history. Doleman's 150.5 rank No. 5. They are two of 25 players with 100 or more career sacks. Eight of those 25 are in the Hall of Fame.
  2. The first chart is a list of the eight Hall of Fame defensive linemen and linebackers whose careers took place during the sack era. I included Oakland Raiders defensive lineman Howie Long and New York Giants linebacker Lawrence Taylor, whose careers began in 1981, and eliminated Bears linebacker Mike Singletary because pass rushing wasn't much of a factor in his enshrinement. All but Long had at least 100 sacks. So while 100-plus sacks doesn't guarantee enshrinement, it's almost always a prerequisite. There is every reason to believe that Peppers, who is 31, and Allen (29) can and will pass that milestone.
  3. Voters clearly perform a subjective judgment to determine which players with high sack totals deserve enshrinement. Generally speaking, players who seem classified as "pure" pass-rushers, including Greene and Doleman, face a higher bar than those who were more generally regarded as "havoc-wreakers." Examples: Long, Andre Tippett, Lawrence Taylor, Rickey Jackson and John Randle.

Given their career arcs, both Peppers and Allen might have to justify a "havoc-wreaker" enshrinement. They've got good chances to break the 100-sack barrier, but how much further will they go? Peppers could reach Randle-Taylor-Richard Dent territory by averaging 10 sacks a year for the next five seasons. I would say that 50 sacks between the ages of 31 and 36 represents the high end of what Peppers might achieve.

Allen is two years younger, and a similar 50-sack run over the next five years could put him in the same territory by 34. That's a reasonable projection, but I wonder if voters will discard Allen into the "pure pass-rusher" category that currently houses Greene, Doleman, Leslie O'Neal (137.5 career sacks), Simeon Rice (122) and Clyde Simmons (121.5).

One gauge to consider is ESPN.com's positional power rankings, which I recognize simply represents the thoughts of eight slappy bloggers. (But remember, Hall of Fame election is determined by 44 other slappy writers and broadcasters.) Allen was rated as the No. 4 pass-rusher but didn't receive a single vote for best defensive player.

For what it's worth, Peppers ranked No. 8 on the overall defensive player list. And I found it interesting last week that when asked to name the NFL's best player at the moment, Bears linebacker Brian Urlacher quickly responded: "Peppers."

In an admittedly subjective question, I ask: If Peppers and Allen finish their careers with similar sack totals, who is more likely to be elected to the Hall of Fame? I'm going to guess Peppers, barring a dramatic career arc adjustment for either player.

Comparing current players to Hall of Famers is only part of the discussion, however. As we noted in our post on Green Bay Packers quarterback Aaron Rodgers, candidates must also be compared to their contemporaries. In theory, only those who dominated their respective eras should be enshrined.

Our next two charts addresses that topic.

Since he entered the league in 2002, Peppers ranks third in sacks. Allen, meanwhile, has more sacks than any NFL player since he was drafted in 2004.

So let's say Peppers and Allen finish their careers in the 130-140 sack range. Both will have been among the most productive pass-rushers of their time, but they'll also be "competing" with a number of contemporaries with similar credentials. We of course hope that all deserving players eventually get in, but the definition of "deserving" can be relative.

To that end, it should be noted that defensive end Michael Strahan (141.5 sacks) would seem relatively assured of enshrinement. End/linebacker Jason Taylor (132.5) and Dwight Freeney (94) will also be considered.

Both Peppers and Allen have potential career spans long enough to settle this debate definitively on their own. But as it stands now, with Peppers entering his 10th season and Allen his eighth, we can say they've done enough to enter the Hall of Fame conversation. Both have more work to do, and it needs to be at the same standard they've set thus far.

Earlier: Rodgers has put himself in on the path toward Canton.

Rams' vets Robbins, Hall getting it done

December, 27, 2010
12/27/10
10:13
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ST. LOUIS -- Fred Robbins' sixth sack of the season Sunday gave the St. Louis Rams' veteran defensive tackle a career high at age 32.

It also highlighted the significant contributions St. Louis is getting from two defensive linemen thought to be past their primes.

Defensive end James Hall, 33, collected 1.5 sacks Sunday, giving him 10.0 for the season.

Hall joins a short list of players to reach double-digit sacks at that age since sacks became an official stat for the 1982 season. The others: Trace Armstrong, Rob Burnett, Richard Dent, Chris Doleman, William Fuller, Kevin Greene, Rickey Jackson, Leslie O'Neal, John Randle, Warren Sapp, Bruce Smith, Michael Strahan, Jason Taylor and Reggie White.

Robbins, signed in free agency from the New York Giants, joins Keith Traylor, Jeff Zgonina and former Ram Ray Agnew among defensive tackles to set career highs for sacks at age 32 or older in the free-agency era (since 1993). The Rams are not particularly deep at defensive tackle. Their defense would have a hard time holding up without Robbins, in my view.

The team needs to draft fresh talent at the position. In the meantime, Robbins is providing the steady play Rams coach Steve Spagnuolo sought when he reconnected with Robbins, a player he coached with the Giants.

Robbins has also set a career high with seven passes defensed.

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